Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

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Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby Matt Hurley » Tue May 26, 2015 2:39 pm

Brethren,

Apologies if this has been raised previously, but have been mulling this over in my on mind and wanted to share to see what you thought about it.

What are you thoughts on a forum based mentoring scheme? for those who would like to participate. Some of the advice given in open forum has been first rate, but wondered if there was an opportunity to development personal relationships, both for the mentor and mentee (if that is the right word). I see the advantages as being; the sharing of knowledge, the development of ourselves, a better understanding of our differences and a learning from both sides of the arrangement; As well as fostering brotherly love.

Where this might not be to everyone's taste, I know I could do with some help sometimes, especially as I was raised under GLoS and now taking my first steps into UGLE. My thoughts would be that people can volunteer to be a mentor, or request that they are looking for a mentor. Of course, the mentoring can be confidential via PM.

What do you think? Is there a need, or are these the wittering's of a mad man?
S&F

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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby MrBenn » Tue May 26, 2015 6:36 pm

The benefit of the forum is that the knowledge gets shared - if you see what I mean

For example: You may have a question about proceedure, or a way of doing something so you ask it in the forum, several people answer and all the people who didn't want to ask the question or were too shy to ask get the benefit of the answer too.

I'm always happy to receive a PM from someone who doesn't want to ask a question openly and then post the question to the forum

Hope that makes sense!
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby eric384 » Tue May 26, 2015 6:56 pm

Being someone who was initiated under GLoS and subsequently moved south, i'm happy to address any problems others may have either publicly or in private.
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby admin » Wed May 27, 2015 6:27 am

As there is an Official post of Mentor in Lodge we have to be careful not to create anything that may be construde as interfering with that post.

But discussion on any subject is just fine.

If anyone wants to ask a question through the PM system here I know of no member here that would ignore that request.
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby Matt Hurley » Wed May 27, 2015 8:38 am

I guess where I was coming from, it that I have seen it used very effectively in the workplace for new starts and more experienced colleagues etc. I have been involved in mentoring before, and apart from the sharing of experiences and knowledge, I felt we both gained something from these exchanges, other than just questions and answers; if you see my point. I know it has helped in my personal development.

Some of the discussions involved aspirations and how best to achieve them, and gave me to opportunity to see the situation through someone else's eyes. It was this point that I was trying to capture and convey here. I agree that no-one would ignore such a PM request, but just wanted to share my thoughts and good experiences with it; as it has certainly helped me in the past.

S&F

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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby Ninth Arch » Wed May 27, 2015 1:18 pm

For me Matt, it was the other way round. Having been Initiated, Passed, Raised and been through the Chair(s) under UGLE, English Mark etc, I found things very different when I moved to Scotland in 2000. I couldn't even work out who the Provincial officers were amongst all the different coloured aprons, or who were PM's as Provincial officers wore rosettes not levels on the aprons. The signs were all different, the Lodge was always squared and everybody adopted the s.o.f. when not giving any other sign (to me it's the s.o.reverence not 'f').

Over time, by trial and error, and by asking what must have been dumb questions, I am probably more familiar now with the Scottish system than my memory of the English way of doing things. This is my fifth year as 1st Principal of a Scottish Royal Arch Chapter for example.

I think this Forum has the balance about right. There are no shortage of experienced Brethren who are ready willing and able to answer any question. Either on the open Forum or by PM if the answer involves giving too much away on an open Forum or involves one of the side Degrees, or indeed is a private question. I don't think an 'official' mentoring website would be any more useful or forthcoming and as has been suggested may 'interfere' or complicate the role of one's own Lodge mentor, who perhaps would be more able to provide advice relevant or specific to that particular Lodge, Also who would you get to staff/moderate such a specific Forum? Would they all have to hold the Office of Mentor? And even if that were possible things vary across UGLE. Thing are different in Lodges in Northumberland than they were in Cheshire (even the language is different - I know I was WM of Mark Lodges firstly in Manchester 1984/85 and then in Northumberland 2007 to 2009).

So I think that this site is excellent for general enquiries and advice. For more 'official' or 'authoritative' advice it is best to seek specific direction from one's own Lodge or Province.
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby neilf8 » Sat May 30, 2015 10:47 pm

I think the idea is good but might need different Mentor for each of GLS and UGLE
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby Eckywan » Sun May 31, 2015 9:53 am

Lovwe the idea and also the comments after
We dont have an office of Mentor in this country
and Ive seen a big problem with lack of mentoring in our "new" university lodge St David 36
who have lots of new studenty members all proposed by RWM or Secy or vice versa then left alone as both are busy
and I have taken on 2 as their mentor ( informally jist as a pal)
but others are left to find their own way and are NOT going to stay!
Ive expressed my concerns there and at GL and appreciate Matt raising it as much as Mr Benn and other comments

Ive enjoyed mentoring in many ways through the years with lots of interesting results !! and fun!

fraternal greetings to all
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby MrBenn » Mon Jun 01, 2015 7:16 am

Encourage the lads to sign up to the forum Ecky, plenty of GLoS members who could advise on specifics and many members from across the world who could offer masonic thoughts!
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby Eckywan » Tue Jun 02, 2015 2:50 pm

Oh dont worry Mr benn I already have
and while also sending them to Bro Bill Batten's Victoria Regalia
Ive also pointed out your sales abilities online!
Some of then even speak English!

frat

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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby Richard George » Wed Jun 03, 2015 8:14 am

Whilst it's a good idea, the problem as I see it is verifying the legitimacy of members. Whilst some of us may be able to verify the legitimacy of UGLE members - and probably Scots can do the same, what about other Constitutions? Who would be happy answering some of the questions that may arise via PM that could be regarded as a violation of Obligations?
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby Matt Hurley » Wed Jun 03, 2015 8:47 am

Thanks Richard

I was thinking this from a personal development point, certainly not about having discussions that would be a violation of obligations.

Appreciate your thoughts.

S&F

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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby Eckywan » Wed Jun 03, 2015 9:51 am

Matt Richard is right in so many ways!
Ive upset a lot of UGLE brethren as my masonic background and rules are soooooo different
( eg we dont have mentors as an office) so we have to be cautious online!

Otherwise we just dont talk about "secrets" here anyway just some advice or questions about how to go about things
and demands that TRUTH be told!
your sign off is exactly as it should be here
we appreciate each others toughts although our point of view may be different
( eg again I'm protestant , very anti catholicism BUT my KT districe just had a divine service in an Abbey ( Nunraw Cistercian Abbey just outside Haddington)

Masonry here is Scottish and older than everyone else's BUT that doesnt mean we are always right!

Fraternally
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby gord_vokes » Wed Jun 03, 2015 10:51 pm

Richard George wrote:Whilst it's a good idea, the problem as I see it is verifying the legitimacy of members. Whilst some of us may be able to verify the legitimacy of UGLE members - and probably Scots can do the same, what about other Constitutions? Who would be happy answering some of the questions that may arise via PM that could be regarded as a violation of Obligations?


As I've told members of the forum, too many times no doubt, that I hail from British Columbia. Officially the Most Worshipful Grand Lodge of British Columbia and Yukon. We use four rituals, unlike our American cousins who are saddled with one only and it has to be word-perfect and they understand little of it''s history as each state uses its own brand of most the Webb-Preston ritual. A ritual taken from William Preston's work and Americanised after the War of Independece. Some of the original 13 colonies kept their own rituals.

Now for those that have beared with me so far will see that things went okay for the USA until about 1820 when the Morgan affair occured. Many many many Lodges had to close down. They even had an Anti-Masonic Party run and fielded a canadidate one year for President. The American masons deciided something must be done, so they didn't let any mason beccome a member until he was raised. (In either 1843 or 1848 {senility is fun with numbers and last names]. Of course after the gold rush in Californnia in '49, our American cousins looked Northward to the gold fields of British Colunbia and the Klondike, which was a hardy trek with no roads, railways and the many rapids of the Fraser River)

Onto BC & Y. One of our four rituals was American rite, although it was called many different names throughout the years: Ancient, Scotch, York, Anccient York etc.

Since I've been I,P, & R'd the rules have changed here. Now we can open in any degree as the two traditional Lodges I presently belong to, always have. In my day the only time I was allowed into a Lodge-room was for the the Three Degrees of Craft Masonry bestowed on me. After being raised I could visit any Lodge I wished to,

After that long-winded introduction; one of the spots I found on the Internet before I was raised that I considered to give legit advice, history, philosopy and proper floor-work (depending on the individual lodge of course) was LodgeRoomUK. And so my brethren, companions, Fraters etc; I am one mason that learned or was directed to the proper books to read on the huge subject of Freemasonry, BTW the MM-only rule stayed in BC & Y for several years afterwards, but I still consider myself a mason that was mentored on the Internet by the sole trust I had in some former and some present members of the Craft that use this A-1 source.

If it wasn't for this forum and several other sites I would never have gone through the chairs and become a PM of the only strict Emulation Lodge that remains on the BC Lower Mainland or asked by the WMGM to sit as a DDGM (District Deputy Grand Master) this year. 17 days to go. (2)

PS: Never confuse Canadian Lodges or Grand Jurisdictions with those South of us. (7)
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby Eckywan » Thu Jun 04, 2015 10:30 am

Hi Gord /brethren
Im so tempted ,,,, and must agree ,,,,
Never confuse Scots lodges with those south of us its sooooo different

On your point of waiting to being raised
Its similar in France with one part I really like
Candidates are likewise restricted till after 3rd
BUT, the bit I like, once they have been vetted by enquiry committee and lodge, they are expected to attended every meeting
even before entering, and stay for the agape/ harmony afterwards . That extends to visitations too
If the lodge is visiting elsewhere, so do the candidates, but stay out of lodge
Once they are apprentices they can go to meetings but if its a 2nd or third, they then leave after opening and wait nearby till harmony

So once their joining is agreed they are treated like full members , and expected to attend every meeting, with a wait of a year between degrees in many lodges, just not able to stay during the actual 2nd or 3rd degree!

frat
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby MrBenn » Thu Jun 04, 2015 12:45 pm

Eckywan wrote:
Its similar in France
....
frat
eckywan


Yes, but which 'France'?
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby admin » Thu Jun 04, 2015 1:33 pm

Comparisons - I have been to both North and South of the Border.

None are better or worse, just different.

I have seen such passion for Freemasonry in Lodge Albert that all I could do was sit back and smile.

I have witnessed some terrible ritual performance. Sometimes by me.

I once saw a Grand Lodge Officer in Freemasons Hall conduct a word perfect installation, he made a minor error in the presentation of the Hall Stone Jewel and broke down and cried. So passion is not restricted to North of us.

The perfection of ritual has little or no meaning if the priniples wrapped in those rituals are not understood.

I had two wonderful friends that could not get any of the ritual right even reading it out of the book. But I have never met their equal as Freemasons before or after they started attending the Grand Lodge above.

The question asked was Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??
Well we already do this job I feel.
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby Richard George » Thu Jun 04, 2015 3:03 pm

What I was getting at was that it's possible for some of us to verify that someone IS actually a mason .. but when talking about non-UK members (remembering that this is a UK-based forum), it's entirely possible for someone to SAY they are a mason - but we only have their word for it .. and for that reason alone, 'mentoring' become a bit more difficult online .. although obviously it depends on what's being asked! - and I'm not accusing anyone of NOT being a mason.
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby admin » Thu Jun 04, 2015 4:09 pm

Sure, however that can be extended to in Lodge.

To gain admittance to a UK Lodge all that is needed is a certificate and a good knowledge of basic ritual.

US its a dues card.

With computers it is certainly not difficult to make false paperwork.

If the answer is no one would be bothered, then we are left with the only ones wanting to be mentored are the true Masons.

It is possible to create extra sections to be used only as mentoring sections , if that is thought to be a good idea.
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Re: Forum Based Mentoring - Your thoughts??

Postby Trouillogan » Thu Jun 04, 2015 7:50 pm

For what it's worth, on this forum it becomes fairly plain after a while whether or not someone is genuinely a Mason. It's the little things in the posts, the experiences shared, the attitudes expressed or implied, the things we find amusing, the similarities and differences between lodge workings; they all tell the tale. The getting to know the man, the building of trust.
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