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Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2019 4:02 pm
by Richard George
Harmony wrote:I find it really annoying at times that Lodges / Chapters etc don't accept subs by direct transfer, as this is what i do for almost every payment.

A subs request comes out, I e-mail to say "can you give me the bank details and I'll set up a standing order", and the response is "We don't do that. Could you just post me a cheque"? My mind boggles every time I get this, and it is the vast majority of the units i am in that seem to insist on cheque or cash.

My view is that Standing Order is easiest all round, especially if you have your name in the payment details so the Treasurer can just tick you off. I also think that it would mean that people just keep paying automatically, rather than needing chased (and probably after they may have left anyway, as people rarely cancel SO's).

Wow! - I've had a Standing Order in place since 1989 when I joined!

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2019 6:32 pm
by Peter Taylor
We have Standing Orders in place.
I pay a monthly fee which covers my annual dues, my weekly collection and a donation to round it up to something you can divide by 12!

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Fri Mar 08, 2019 12:34 pm
by Wurzell
Thank you Brethren for the superb and very useful replies.

@Trouillogan in particular for your spot on reply on [url]masonic-forum.com[/url]

"The answer might be to get an up to date Book of Constitutions! All editions since 2012 have had as the final sentence to rule 153(a), the following:

The Lodge may by resolution authorise the Treasurer, but on no pretence any other Brother, to make payments from the Lodge’s account by electronic means; in the absence of any such resolution all payments from Lodge funds shall be made by cash or by cheque.

The newest edition of the B of C is 2018 but is also downloadable from here:

https://www.ugle.org.uk/about/book-of-constitutions"

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Fri Mar 08, 2019 12:35 pm
by Wurzell
Thank you Brethren for the superb and very useful replies.

@Trouillogan in particular for your spot on reply on masonic-forum.com

"The answer might be to get an up to date Book of Constitutions! All editions since 2012 have had as the final sentence to rule 153(a), the following:

The Lodge may by resolution authorise the Treasurer, but on no pretence any other Brother, to make payments from the Lodge’s account by electronic means; in the absence of any such resolution all payments from Lodge funds shall be made by cash or by cheque.

The newest edition of the B of C is 2018 but is also downloadable from here:

https://www.ugle.org.uk/about/book-of-constitutions"

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Fri Mar 08, 2019 12:37 pm
by Wurzell
Thank you Brethren for the superb and very useful replies.

@Trouillogan in particular for your spot on reply on https://masonic-forum.com/

To quote:

The answer might be to get an up to date Book of Constitutions! All editions since 2012 have had as the final sentence to rule 153(a), the following:

The Lodge may by resolution authorise the Treasurer, but on no pretence any other Brother, to make payments from the Lodge’s account by electronic means; in the absence of any such resolution all payments from Lodge funds shall be made by cash or by cheque.

The newest edition of the B of C is 2018 but is also downloadable from here:

https://www.ugle.org.uk/about/book-of-constitutions

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Fri Mar 08, 2019 11:46 pm
by Trouillogan
Glad to have been of assistance - but one 'thank you' is quite enough!

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2019 12:26 pm
by Wurzell
My ongoing frustration with the relationship between Freemasonry and banking continues. I have been elected as treasurer of my Chapter. Trying to take over the HSBC held account is proving to be a complete nightmare. I was initially given a set of forms in June to complete, I did so but because I moved house in July by the time I got them all signed off and ready for submission I carefully blanked out my old address with cut out strips showing my new address in the boxes provided. Our Scribe E. dropped the forms off at the branch where the account is held. Speedily we received a letter telling us they had been rejected because the address for me had been altered on the virgin form. Also, any changes had to be completed online by then.

The outgoing treasurer duly spent an age both online and on the phone going through the necessary forms which were then duly completed and sent in by mail. This was rejected as well because the forms had not been ‘signed in accordance with our signing rules.

We currently only have the two signatories the outgoing treasurer and one of our more senior members who has held just about every post in Chapter that ever existed.

This batting contest continued with several attempts to tick all the boxes. Yesterday having completed yet another set of mandates I had an appointment in HSBC Bath with a Business Banking Manager (there is no longer one in the local towns where the account is held or the one to which I have now moved). The young lady went through the mandate that was trying to get me listed as a signatory but speedily concluded that the problem lay with the fact there is no record of who the current Secretary is (Scribe E) nor is the Scribe E listed as a signatory. Neither of the two current signatories is designates as Secretary. Therefore, it seems we are at a total impasse as the jobsworth form must be signed off by the current secretary who must also be listed as a signatory. I have now again written to their customer relations department seeking their advice on how we might resolve this seemingly impossible conundrum.

I have explored the options to 'switch' the bank account to another bank but because I'm not a signatory I can't start that process. Meanwhile, the active year is upon us and subs are trickling in.

Has anyone experience and a recommendation toward how we might get around this silly issue, please?

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2019 4:02 pm
by Trouillogan
Banking Ombudsman??

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2019 8:04 pm
by Wurzell
An excellent suggestion thank you for making it Trouillogan. As it seems that others have experienced the same issue with this particular bank I think I will explore that. After all we are asking for something relatively easy to complete and the fact they seem to be cloth-eared about it makes me wonder if they are trying to make Treasurer accounts with them a bit of history.

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Sun Dec 29, 2019 11:27 am
by Trouillogan
Best of luck, Wurzell, I hope they can help. It would seem that some banks are really awkward when it comes to treasurer accounts. Fortunately one of my lodges has an ex-bank manager as treasurer and he seems to have both the 'mason word' and the 'banker word', if there is such a thing!

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Sun Dec 29, 2019 1:00 pm
by Richard George
Trouillogan wrote:the 'banker word', if there is such a thing!

Quite probably!!

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Thu Jan 02, 2020 9:32 am
by Matatu Man
Both my UK Royal Arch Chapter and KT Preceptory have always been quite happy to receive a bank transfer from me and other members who are resident on the Continent, as cheques haven't existed here since the 90s.

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2020 9:52 am
by admin
I agree I set up Standing Orders some time back just a photo copied paper which member fill in and that can be a rough figure taking into account meals etc. When I had both jobs I had an SO just for Lodge and included Chapter fees which I just paid over in a lump sum.

Paying checks into a Lloyds account can be done at any Post Office, just takes longer to clear and you need a Lloyds paying in slip.

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 6:03 pm
by Wurzell
It's great to see that UGLE have included a BACS payment option this year with their annual return. Will this now catch on with Provincial Lodges?

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 7:53 am
by Richard George
We've been able to pay Province by BACS for a couple of years now.

Re: Lodge Bank Accounts - BACS payments

PostPosted: Sun Jan 26, 2020 12:52 pm
by Mike Martin
My favourite catch phrase at talks - "47 Provinces, 30 different ways to do exactly the same thing".