Rank in Freemasonry

[EssexMason]

Sounds very much like: Some achieve rank, and some have it thrust upon them. Are any born with rank ?

[Multisync]

Be more like me just realize it isn't of concern and get on with what you do Freemasonry for. I have been made aware of so called badge chasers but the ones I have met seem nice enough.They don't affect my world apart from pleasantries at the bar etc. Ironically the only Freemason I can remember feeling a certain reticence about got rather high in the province having only 'met' him twice both in full regalia (and was blanked on both occasions)
but I won't speak ill of the dead on this one

Correct me if I am wrong but In order to get a badge above your due seems to mean either

you have run yourself ragged ferrying round various chains here there and everywhere

volunteered your services for free,
marry the bosses daughter
give a tidy wad to the Provincial nominated charity.

None of which apply to me so good luck to those who they do, crack on .

I simply cannot get worked up about all this and hence let it all sail over my head blissfully unaware

[Lloyd Wiebe]

Be more like me just realize it isn't of concern and get on with what you do Freemasonry for. I have been made aware of so called badge chasers but the ones I have met seem nice enough.They don't affect my world apart from pleasantries at the bar etc. Ironically the only Freemason I can remember feeling a certain reticence about got rather high in the province having only 'met' him twice both in full regalia (and was blanked on both occasions)
but I won't speak ill of the dead on this one

Correct me if I am wrong but In order to get a badge above your due seems to mean either

you have run yourself ragged ferrying round various chains here there and everywhere

volunteered your services for free,
marry the bosses daughter
give a tidy wad to the Provincial nominated charity.

None of which apply to me so good luck to those who they do, crack on .

I simply cannot get worked up about all this and hence let it all sail over my head blissfully unaware

I can't help but give this post the thumbs up.

[middlepillar]

I have said this many times before but as this thread has been revived I will repeat myself.

Rank only affects those who worry about it. Masonically it should be a non issue how does someone else's Rank affect you (unless you let it?)

An absolute waste of time to worry about something that should make no difference to your own Masonry.

Multis sync, you have left one off of your list (I agree with the ones you have on it though)

You list;

you have run yourself ragged ferrying round various chains here there and everywhere
volunteered your services for free,
marry the bosses daughter
give a tidy wad to the Provincial nominated charity.

You have left out;

You do all the Offices because you like to, you perform your year in the chair well because you want to, you support your Lodge over the following years because you want to, your secretary submits a form letting those that need to know, know that you have been a loyal servant to the Lodge in general and Masonry in particular.

But maybe there are easier ways to get Rank?

[bboy]

agreed MP, rank or honorary rank only seems to bother those who dont get it. its the same as being invited to join other orders, those that bother about are the ones who dont get asked!

enjoy freemasonry for what it is, and it means many different things to different people.

Que Sera, Sera - whatever will be, will be : as the song goes!

[MrMason]

Most of our members run a mile at joining PGL so if any PM wishes a PGL office just affiliate to my lodge we'll propose you for our PGL and after about 15 yrs of going up through each office you'll be a Past Provincial Grand WSW.

During these years you can also put your name forward for the PGM's job when it comes along every 5 years.

Oh and our PGL provides the regalia for each office so no extra expense!

[bboy]

i have to say Bob, that its getting harder to get brethren to fill the offices at Provincial level. not sure if its the same in Dumfries?

its an additional commitment over and above Lodge and other orders.

[JulesTheBit]

.... an absolute waste of time to worry about something that should make no difference to your own Masonry.

There are occasionally exceptions to that Chris. For example if you want to be a VO. With a tiny number of exceptions you have to achieve a certain rank to get the job.

S&F, Jules

[eric384]

i have to say Bob, that its getting harder to get brethren to fill the offices at Provincial level. not sure if its the same in Dumfries?

its an additional commitment over and above Lodge and other orders.

I think it's something you have to accept that if you have active Provincial office, then something else has to give. Our Royal Arch Grand Superintendent has given up office in the Preceptory for the duration of his appointment due to conflicts with dates - particularly at this time of year when all the RA Orders and KT have their installations.

[Mike Martin]

Rank only affects those who worry about it. Masonically it should be a non issue how does someone else's Rank affect you (unless you let it?)

While I do understand your point I should clarify that I am particularly un-bothered about Honours/Ranks above and beyond my own belief that the London system is fairer, pretty transparent not divisive and therefore more Masonic.

My disaffection with the provincial version was caused by watching arguments in open Lodge two years running about who got which level of provincial honour and why. The first year two of the participants resigned from the Lodge and the second year I resigned rather than continue to witness the disharmony it was causing each year. Since that time I have also witnessed others in different provinces getting heated and sometimes abusive regarding imagined slights due to the level of the "honour" received by them or their Lodge mates.

[middlepillar]

.... an absolute waste of time to worry about something that should make no difference to your own Masonry.

There are occasionally exceptions to that Chris. For example if you want to be a VO. With a tiny number of exceptions you have to achieve a certain rank to get the job.

S&F, Jules

Hi Jules

Speaking for myself, I did not want or chase the appointment of VO, my own Lodges SVO basically asked if I minded my name being put forward, as I have enjoyed all of my masonry over the years I said I had no problem it will be good to put something back. I received a telephone call from My SVO whom I report to and we met up for a drink had a chat and afterwards I received a letter asking me if I would do it.

So personally I have never worried about any rank or honour because it is no concern for me, if a brother receives something that he does not deserve it has no influence on my enjoyment of my Masonry so it is a non starter as far as I am concerned, good luck to him and hopefully he will grow in to deserving the honour but if he doesnt, hey shit happens!

[MrMason]

I've met one or two VO's during my trips south but never really asked what their role is?

If I have been told in the past I apologise but I can't remember. Probably down to copious amounts of lemonade fed to me!!!

[NeilThomasAllen]

If I have been told in the past I apologise but I can't remember. Probably down to copious amounts of lemonade fed to me!!!

"lemonade" ;)

[Peter Moir]

A very important point to remember is, that in Scotland it is the Brethren of your Lodge that recommend you for PG office. It's up to them whose name goes forward for consideration by Provincial Grand Lodge.

[JulesTheBit]

I've met one or two VO's during my trips south but never really asked what their role is?

If I have been told in the past I apologise but I can't remember. Probably down to copious amounts of lemonade fed to me!!!

In London a VO is the link man between the Lodges and MetGL. He reports to a Senior Visiting Officer, who in turn reports to Metropolitan Grand Inspector. With 1,400 Lodges in London, plus RA Chapters, there has to be a communications structure and the VO is the lowest level of that structure.

We remind secretaries of interesting events, and we're the entry point to the Honours system. Also, if an unusual situation arises and the Lodge wants input or help the VO is the first person to call.

There are no badges or ranks for VOs.

Unlike Chris I did actively seek a VO role. It's a job with little reward but I really enjoy it, it's an opportunity to give something back for all I've got out of Freemasonry myself.

S&F, Jules

[middlepillar]

Unlike Chris I did actively seek a VO role. It's a job with little reward but I really enjoy it, it's an opportunity to give something back for all I've got out of Freemasonry myself.

S&F, Jules

I would like to re-emphasise the point that although I did not actively seek to become a VO it is a job I accepted with pleasure for the same reasons that Jules has mentioned. I have taken a great deal from my Masonic membership and being a VO is a small way of paying something back, I consider it a priviledge to be able to contribute in a small but significant way.

However being a VO really has little to do with the OP of 'Rank in Freemasonry' it is unpaid, time consuming but very rewarding.

[MrMason]

Many thanks for the explanation Jules.

I agree with Peter M that in Scotland it is down to the lodge to nominate those brethren for PGL. But like Barri's PGL it is not so much getting members to join PGL but to actually remain in office.
We have to attend at least 5 PGL meetings/visitations to remain on the list and progress each year and while that isn't really a great deal over the year I resigned as I was having things clashing all over the place. I'm still in PG Chapter and our District Grand Priory but these take fewer commitments.

Appointed ranks lead to far more meetings which seems to be the problem as you have to do the job.
Scottish lodges also appoint some of their members onto the PGL Stewards board. In my lodges' case it is the JD and SD each year that are made members as well as those other PM's.

[BOBCOLLINZ]

The obsession of UGLE freemasons with rank or honours is counter productive, and this obsession enables UGLE to control every aspect of masonry in the UK by the threat of withdrawal of favour. For the good of freemasonry it should be abolished. It will not be of course because UGLE has a vested interest in it, but I urge you all to resist it.

[MrBenn]

Quite a harsh and unfair judgement - unless you have met every single UGLE freemason and asked them about their attitude to rank

I for one couldn't care less about rank

[Peter Taylor]

The obsession of UGLE freemasons with rank or honours is counter productive, and this obsession enables UGLE to control every aspect of masonry in the UK by the threat of withdrawal of favour. For the good of freemasonry it should be abolished. It will not be of course because UGLE has a vested interest in it, but I urge you all to resist it.

I'm sorry Brother but this seems quite inappropriate. For a start UGLE does not have a "control every aspect of masonry in the UK"; certainly not in Scotland and Ireland. I know many many English Freemasons that are very much on the level and not at all concerned about rank

I would also remind you of the Rules of the forum:
"C/ Criticisms Of Specific Grand Lodges
While it may be reasonably argued that some Grand Lodges are losing site of the purpose of Freemasonry, it is unfair to point fingers at any one Grand Lodge. We have members of virtually every Grand Lodge on the forum. Thus an attack on any one grand lodge is an attack on our forum member from that Grand Lodge. We also have several Grand Lodge officers here who are trying to make a difference, both on the forum and in their Grand Body. If you have issues with a specific Grand Lodge, please take it up with that Grand Lodge via your lodge secretary."